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Post by prettyboyfloyd on Jun 27, 2011 15:00:13 GMT 1
Yes i would like to see that info Judge: With prove when you find.There would be many jealous people out there trying to shoot him down.Friedman is a Nuclear Physicist.I doubt it hes hard up for money mate.The difference between him & Pope.He would put the evidence in front of your face.Where as Pope gives you nothing lol.Pope got hes Ufo expertise out of a weeties packet. Cheers:Prettyboyfloyd
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 15:05:56 GMT 1
Hello pbf, hiflier: Whats your point?So he has hes own websight.So what.A man of hes calibre would.What you think hes peddling to make money of them books & dvds?Nothing is for nothing lol. Cheers:Prettyboyfloyd I say this respectfully, prettyboyfloyd, in the overall Truth of it, Stanton doesn't get anyone any further than Nick does! Why should anyone have to PAY for Truth. None of these people are offended in the slightest that conference vendors ride their coat tails selling crap to the droppings the speakers' lecture tables. You have to admit there is NO ONE out there with an answer! If there was it would be free, Earth shattering, and would NOT be in a damned book or on a damned DVD! Sorry for the rant- Little makes any sense to me WRT to UFOs other that "experts" obvious motives.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 15:07:28 GMT 1
Yes i would like to see that info Judge: With prove when you find.There would be many jealous people out there trying to shoot him down.Friedman is a Nuclear Physicist.I doubt it hes hard up for money mate.The difference between him & Pope.He would put the evidence in front of your face.Where as Pope gives you nothing lol.Pope got hes Ufo expertise out of a weeties packet. Cheers:Prettyboyfloyd There's no comparrison between Friedman and Pope, Friedman is way above him in terms of research. Pope is just a puippet. I would say that Timothy Good is probably the best Ufologist/Researcher his books are second to none
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 15:11:52 GMT 1
Hello pbf, hiflier: Whats your point?So he has hes own websight.So what.A man of hes calibre would.What you think hes peddling to make money of them books & dvds?Nothing is for nothing lol. Cheers:Prettyboyfloyd I say this respectfully, prettyboyfloyd, in the overall Truth of it, Stanton doesn't get anyone any further than Nick does! Why should anyone have to PAY for Truth. None of these people are offended in the slightest that conference vendors ride their coat tails selling crap to the droppings the speakers' lecture tables. You have to admit there is NO ONE out there with an answer! If there was it would be free, Earth shattering, and would NOT be in a damned book or on a damned DVD! Sorry for the rant- Little makes any sense to me WRT to UFOs other that "experts" obvious motives. Ill counter this argument When these reseachers do lectures they have to pay for the venues where they hold them. Sometimes they have to travel all round the world to do them too, Books are a way of getting there research out to the general public. It all costs money so when they do these conferences they have to charge, simple really
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 15:13:34 GMT 1
........The difference between him & Pope.He would put the evidence in front of your face......... He doesn't have anything any more substantial than anyone else. What criteria is used that determines the title "expert' anyway? we've heard them for 64 years running. They've got nothing. Evidence is good is that it supports a theory. And a theory is all ET is.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 15:23:44 GMT 1
........The difference between him & Pope.He would put the evidence in front of your face......... He doesn't have anything any more substantial than anyone else. What criteria is used that determines the title "expert' anyway? we've heard them for 64 years running. They've got nothing. Evidence is good is that it supports a theory. And a theory is all ET is. What determines an Expert is someone that has many many years of field research done in a scientific manner. Someone that has studied all the evidence that is available. To say there is no evidence is well naive to say the least as there is loads of evidence. Granted there is no 100% concrete evidence but when witnesses such as pilots military personel NASA employees astronauts etc speak out then you have to sit up and listen.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 15:25:37 GMT 1
Hello uforn, Hello pbf, I say this respectfully, prettyboyfloyd, in the overall Truth of it, Stanton doesn't get anyone any further than Nick does! Why should anyone have to PAY for Truth. None of these people are offended in the slightest that conference vendors ride their coat tails selling crap to the droppings the speakers' lecture tables. You have to admit there is NO ONE out there with an answer! If there was it would be free, Earth shattering, and would NOT be in a damned book or on a damned DVD! Sorry for the rant- Little makes any sense to me WRT to UFOs other that "experts" obvious motives. Ill counter this argument When these reseachers do lectures they have to pay for the venues where they hold them. Sometimes they have to travel all round the world to do them too, Books are a way of getting there research out to the general public. It all costs money so when they do these conferences they have to charge, simple really I'm not the least bit in the dark about the mechanics of this. I'm boiling all of it down to motive. These folks KNOW there is no answer and yet they go around the halls for years making money on their long-standing spiels that are clever enough to HELP folks believe in something that's just going to go nowhere except to the bank account. Now one may think I'm just being a cynic here but I'm being very pragmatic about the entire UFO industry It's a money-maker big time. And the so-called "experts" feed the coffers unabashedly and without shame.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 15:33:40 GMT 1
Hello uforn, Ill counter this argument When these reseachers do lectures they have to pay for the venues where they hold them. Sometimes they have to travel all round the world to do them too, Books are a way of getting there research out to the general public. It all costs money so when they do these conferences they have to charge, simple really I'm not the least bit in the dark about the mechanics of this. I'm boiling all of it down to motive. These folks KNOW there is no answer and yet they go around the halls for years making money on their long-standing spiels that are clever enough to HELP folks believe in something that's just going to go nowhere except to the bank account. Now one may think I'm just being a cynic here but I'm being very pragmatic about the entire UFO industry It's a money-maker big time. And the so-called "experts" feed the coffers unabashedly and without shame. I get what your saying but this is the biggest secret ever and has been covered up from the start. Watch this video of witness testimonies. I dissagree that its going nowhere you only have to look at mainstream science, you will be hard pressed to find a scientist these days that dont believe there is intelligent life on other planets. Sightings of UFO's go back thousands of years is not a new thing you only have to read the bible to see that.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 15:42:49 GMT 1
Hello uforn, He doesn't have anything any more substantial than anyone else. What criteria is used that determines the title "expert' anyway? we've heard them for 64 years running. They've got nothing. Evidence is good is that it supports a theory. And a theory is all ET is. What determines an Expert is someone that has many many years of field research done in a scientific manner. Someone that has studied all the evidence that is available. To say there is no evidence is well naive to say the least as there is loads of evidence. Granted there is no 100% concrete evidence but when witnesses such as pilots military personel NASA employees astronauts etc speak out then you have to sit up and listen. Good for you! And I mean it. You used a very key term that completely underscores my point. The term was "available evidence". I've seen and read a lot on this subject thanks to you guys and, nearly everywhere, just before one thinks the answer will be in the next moment- THAT term pops up. Does anyone think they know what "that" term implies? Allow me to illuminate a bit more the subject of this thread- Most folks when they hear the term don't really hear it. They miss the true meaning the word "available means. I means "never-to-be-realeased" evidence. "Available evidence" is nothing more than gov-speak. It's as obvious as other terms such as "available sources", "available facts" etc. Pragmatic, unblinded logic. It can be very useful in keeping people out of the rabbit holes if one is aware of how language gets used in as sensitive a subject as this is.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 16:01:07 GMT 1
Hello uforn, Hello uforn, I'm not the least bit in the dark about the mechanics of this. I'm boiling all of it down to motive. These folks KNOW there is no answer and yet they go around the halls for years making money on their long-standing spiels that are clever enough to HELP folks believe in something that's just going to go nowhere except to the bank account. Now one may think I'm just being a cynic here but I'm being very pragmatic about the entire UFO industry It's a money-maker big time. And the so-called "experts" feed the coffers unabashedly and without shame. I get what your saying but this is the biggest secret ever and has been covered up from the start. Watch this video of witness testimonies. I dissagree that its going nowhere you only have to look at mainstream science, you will be hard pressed to find a scientist these days that dont believe there is intelligent life on other planets. Sightings of UFO's go back thousands of years is not a new thing you only have to read the bible to see that. Belief is not at issue here trust me. And I could very well BE hard pressed to find a scientist that does not believe there is intelligent life on other planets. Again, belief is not at issue here. and never have been. It doesn't even need to enter into this dialogue. They don't KNOW though. No one does. And disclosure is all about proving the existence UFOs. I find no fault there at all! The so-called experts believe in them, or say they do. Lots of folks believe in them- most sight unseen. But the ALIEN part is a presumption that just launches the entire business to the next level. THAT my friend is not, and won't be, part of the official/ disclosed picture. That is the assumption that drives everything to the world of big UFO finance. There is absolutely no constraint on what passes for truth. Anyone can say anything and no one can refute it. UFOs? Sure why not. Aliens- whoa not so fast. Available evidence indeed! Who's kidding who here?
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Post by simplyerik on Jun 27, 2011 16:10:59 GMT 1
I once sent an email to Mr Stanton Friedman's email telling him that I like the work he has done. And asked a couple questions in it. I don't remember what I had said but I got back an autoreply email saying "Thank you for visiting the site." and "If you want to learn more about the subject buy the DVD's and books." That pissed me off. I felt as if they were trying to use my curiosity for profit.
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Post by meldrew on Jun 27, 2011 16:12:19 GMT 1
I haven't met the pope, I was in the same room as him, and had to endure a boring load of flannel he talked, but I did witness him squirm as he had to publicly apologise to some rendlesham forest witnesses who he had not publicly supported, even though he knew something, for a pretty good list of good/dodgy researchers there is a hall of fame/shame posted in the off topic section , but the pope doesn't make either list ? the pope is not a researcher full stop, he's a spokesman thats all, he is only allowed to comment on what is already in the public domain, offically that is, he is a short weedy dude who was probably bad at sport so he was stuck behind a desk, the spiel I had to endure was mainly his attempt to justify why he has nothing important to say, he did not make any money out of the event I attended, all profits went to a childrens hospice.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 16:22:38 GMT 1
Hello uforn, What determines an Expert is someone that has many many years of field research done in a scientific manner. Someone that has studied all the evidence that is available. To say there is no evidence is well naive to say the least as there is loads of evidence. Granted there is no 100% concrete evidence but when witnesses such as pilots military personel NASA employees astronauts etc speak out then you have to sit up and listen. Good for you! And I mean it. You used a very key term that completely underscores my point. The term was "available evidence". I've seen and read a lot on this subject thanks to you guys and, nearly everywhere, just before one thinks the answer will be in the next moment- THAT term pops up. Does anyone think they know what "that" term implies? Allow me to illuminate a bit more the subject of this thread- Most folks when they hear the term don't really hear it. They miss the true meaning the word "available means. I means "never-to-be-realeased" evidence. "Available evidence" is nothing more than gov-speak. It's as obvious as other terms such as "available sources", "available facts" etc. Pragmatic, unblinded logic. It can be very useful in keeping people out of the rabbit holes if one is aware of how language gets used in as sensitive a subject as this is. The answer isnt going to come out in one go, Govts are releasing there UFO files all over the world, even the Vatican got in on the act by stating that there is most probably extraterestrial life and that it wouldnt harm religion as they would be the creation of god. Governm,ents are slowly conditioning the public to the reality that aliens have visited us. Even the media has taken the subject serious 10 years ago it was laughed at, not anymore. Youve got a hell of alot more reading to do hiflier, take the sumarian texts one of the oldest written language's we have, Zacharia Sitchen decoded them and they tell the story of an ancient civilisation that came to earth they were called the Anunnaki, they state that they got all there knowlege from them.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 16:25:27 GMT 1
Hello meldrew,
Thank you for elaborating. The children's stuff is to his credit. I was slamming the conferences a few months back and you can probably word for word imagine the dialogue. One of the mods on my Forum was involved in one and so I wrote a respectful PM and was informed that all the proceeds from that particular were for charity. Good on them as well!
I need to look further into this idea and see what percentage generates this sort of idea. My guess is the ticket sales go there but not vendor revenues- at least not all revenues. We'll see.
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Post by prettyboyfloyd on Jun 27, 2011 16:26:22 GMT 1
simplyerik An auto reply would piss off anyone lol.Nothing is for nothing & time is money mate.Im sure Friedman would reply if he had the time. Cheers:Prettyboyfloyd
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 16:37:00 GMT 1
Hello uforn,
Thanks for the tip. Yes, I actually have looked into that as well as others that have "contact" in their histories. At this juncture it makes for interesting reading. If there is a thread here on propulsion, the next logical direction would be to go there. If not- I'll start one.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 16:37:34 GMT 1
I haven't met the pope, I was in the same room as him, and had to endure a boring load of flannel he talked, but I did witness him squirm as he had to publicly apologise to some rendlesham forest witnesses who he had not publicly supported, even though he knew something, for a pretty good list of good/dodgy researchers there is a hall of fame/shame posted in the off topic section , but the pope doesn't make either list ? the pope is not a researcher full stop, he's a spokesman thats all, he is only allowed to comment on what is already in the public domain, offically that is, he is a short weedy dude who was probably bad at sport so he was stuck behind a desk, the spiel I had to endure was mainly his attempt to justify why he has nothing important to say, he did not make any money out of the event I attended, all profits went to a childrens hospice. Good post about Pope that is all he is a spokesperson nothing else.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 16:39:54 GMT 1
Hello uforn, Thanks for the tip. Yes, I actually have looked into that as well as others that have "contact" in their histories. At this juncture it makes for interesting reading. If there is a thread here on propulsion, the next logical direction would be to go there. If not- I'll start one. I dont think there is m8 by all means start one
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Post by meldrew on Jun 27, 2011 17:39:41 GMT 1
thats the biggest argument we have had before, why not a being from another planet or even another time, to just say theres no such thing is daft when you consider that space is eternal in every direction, and for example, would you believe in dinosaurs if they were just a story and no proof exists ? start with ancient aliens and have a good read up, as I have said before, we don't know how the pyramids were built but they exist, I am one of the more sceptical on here but there is a lot of info out there to suggest that we are visited, I do draw the line at space whales though.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2011 19:20:43 GMT 1
Hello meldrew,
We may not always agree on everything but when it comes to the space whales there's not much choice. Yes indeed space is huge and the question of the possibility of intelligent life needs no discussion. In otherwords it certainly is possible, maybe even probable but not as certain as the dinosaurs by any stretch. We have bones- or at least the representation of them in sediments. If we didn't then no, I would not think they existed. Ancient Aliens? the books and subject are almost overwhelming but alas, the proof is not. Why is it that after thousands of years not one Alien cadaver or skeleton for the public, compliments of an authority that felt it was in the best interest of the World's population to know such things existed? Prove existence and the balance of power will shift. Money will shift. It's the reality if history teaches anything.
Where I'm situated right now is this: Do I think that UFOs exist? Without a doubt! There is a small percentage of things that fly whose nature is unknown. Period. The rest is up for review. In better terms? Where are the metaphorical bones? If someone has a set someone's not telling. Well, at least someone's not telling me anyway.
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Post by uforn on Jun 27, 2011 20:03:49 GMT 1
Hello meldrew, We may not always agree on everything but when it comes to the space whales there's not much choice. Yes indeed space is huge and the question of the possibility of intelligent life needs no discussion. In otherwords it certainly is possible, maybe even probable but not as certain as the dinosaurs by any stretch. We have bones- or at least the representation of them in sediments. If we didn't then no, I would not think they existed. Ancient Aliens? the books and subject are almost overwhelming but alas, the proof is not. Why is it that after thousands of years not one Alien cadaver or skeleton for the public, compliments of an authority that felt it was in the best interest of the World's population to know such things existed? Prove existence and the balance of power will shift. Money will shift. It's the reality if history teaches anything. Where I'm situated right now is this: Do I think that UFOs exist? Without a doubt! There is a small percentage of things that fly whose nature is unknown. Period. The rest is up for review. In better terms? Where are the metaphorical bones? If someone has a set someone's not telling. Well, at least someone's not telling me anyway. I totaly dissagree that there is no proof for the Ancient Alien Theory. There are many unexplained artifacts and indeed structures, buildings and carvings. Take this carving below, it is from Armenia's Stonehenge it dates back to around 7500 yrs ago its believed to be older than the great pyramid. Now if this carving does not resemble an Alien Grey ill eat my hat. Now tell me hiflier why would an ancient civilisation depict something like this in there carvings if they had not seen it ?
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Post by meldrew on Jun 27, 2011 20:45:31 GMT 1
hiflier have you ever thought that your education and the way everything needs to be proven might be at fault, it gives me the hump when people say "show me the proof" and what about when science is taught in school then 20 years later the new generation of scientists say that was wrong, its now changed, this happens all the time you know, so tell me please your explanation for ooparts, artifacts that have not been successfully explained by science,why not take the view that something does exist untill it is proven not to not the other way around.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2011 5:23:19 GMT 1
Hello All,
Centaurs, unicorns, sphinxes, statues of ancient gods, carvings of Anubis. Various Greek and Roman gods. Countless other carved, sculpted, engraved and painted representations of people, dieties, spirit beings, and others. India alone has many- Shiva for one. I will not attempt, nor do I wish to attempt debunking any of this. I will not attempt to debunk ETs. I've at least said that it is possible that they exist. It is not probable IMHO that thet are here.
Can I be wrong? Well of course! Am I wrong? I certainly could be. But I will not study anything on the premise that I THINK it's true. My work needs to be focused on determining if it's true or not true. Even a belief of "maybe" can slant the evidence. Does a thing fit if the subject was to be seen as true? Does the same thing fit if the subject was to be seen as untrue? An example of this would be if I were to see an UFO. Both sides of the coin would fit. And the elimination process continues.
M.K. Jessup did a good job of this in "The Case For the UFO". However, he already believed in ET so his logic, though good in process of elimination skill, was skewed in favor of existence. It's not easy but I'm trying to not fall into that mindset. The work I've done for nearly four and a half months now depends on my unbiased viewpoint in order to validate it's promotion. I cannot at this time jeopardise it's completion by having the various Forums perceive it to be anything but an objective exercise.
Once done, I will be freer to delve deeper into the ET concepts. I hope My position is clearer and the reasons I need to remain as I am, a non-believer.
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Post by uforn on Jun 28, 2011 13:55:03 GMT 1
Hello All, Centaurs, unicorns, sphinxes, statues of ancient gods, carvings of Anubis. Various Greek and Roman gods. Countless other carved, sculpted, engraved and painted representations of people, dieties, spirit beings, and others. India alone has many- Shiva for one. I will not attempt, nor do I wish to attempt debunking any of this. I will not attempt to debunk ETs. I've at least said that it is possible that they exist. It is not probable IMHO that thet are here. Can I be wrong? Well of course! Am I wrong? I certainly could be. But I will not study anything on the premise that I THINK it's true. My work needs to be focused on determining if it's true or not true. Even a belief of "maybe" can slant the evidence. Does a thing fit if the subject was to be seen as true? Does the same thing fit if the subject was to be seen as untrue? An example of this would be if I were to see an UFO. Both sides of the coin would fit. And the elimination process continues. M.K. Jessup did a good job of this in "The Case For the UFO". However, he already believed in ET so his logic, though good in process of elimination skill, was skewed in favor of existence. It's not easy but I'm trying to not fall into that mindset. The work I've done for nearly four and a half months now depends on my unbiased viewpoint in order to validate it's promotion. I cannot at this time jeopardise it's completion by having the various Forums perceive it to be anything but an objective exercise. Once done, I will be freer to delve deeper into the ET concepts. I hope My position is clearer and the reasons I need to remain as I am, a non-believer. I dont blame you for not wanting to try to debunk it as it would end in a big failure My work also needs to be focused on whats true and what is not, the answers are out there if you look for them, youve only been interested for around 4 months ? Thats not a very long time at all, your going to have to do a hell of alot more research as it wont come to you.
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Post by meldrew on Jun 28, 2011 15:05:05 GMT 1
I read my first ufo book in 84 and have read quite a few since and I still know jack lol, the subject is too vast to claim to know all of it.
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Post by uforn on Jun 28, 2011 16:00:21 GMT 1
I read my first ufo book in 84 and have read quite a few since and I still know jack lol, the subject is too vast to claim to know all of it. I first got into UFO's when I was 6yrs old Im nearly 40 now and still dont know everything there's a hell of alot more to learn
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