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Post by astropete on Feb 21, 2014 23:48:41 GMT 1
Hello everyone,
I'm Pete and I'm an astronomer and citizen scientist. I've come here because I'm interested in learning more about UFO's, what are they? What causes them? Are they a natural phenomenon? Are they explainable? Are they indeed extraterrestrial?
This is the first forum I've found so far, so I thought I'd sign up.
Honestly, I'm about 50/50 on the whole thing... One part of me wants to believe, the other part is more skeptical. I've read many of the Project Blue Book files and looked at many videos and pictures, and while I can see that some of the objects can be explained as rather mundane things (for example I recently saw a picture that was described as a double, semi transparent UFO, which was the reflection of a light bulb in a double glazed window), I've also seen that there are a number that seem to defy rational explanation. It's these latter objects that I'm most interested in.
As an astronomer I have taken part in some SETI research and I'm well versed in physics. I know that the power consumption to get from even our nearest neighbouring solar system to here with any speed would be enormous and well beyond the capabilities of human science. You could get there using a sleeper ship or a multi-generational vessel, but it would take a very long time indeed. That being said, with a mathematical possibility of around 400 billion stars in our galaxy alone (and there being an estimated 500 billion galaxies like ours) the odds that our sun is the only one with a life sustaining planet orbiting it are rather slim indeed, especially if you take into account the recent Kepler findings of exoplanets in their own stars "Goldilocks Zones".
I believe whole heartedly that there is life elsewhere in the Universe. Has that life reached Earth? I'm not sure, but I'd like to find out.
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Post by ronologic on Feb 22, 2014 2:57:37 GMT 1
Welcome aboard astropete. You will find a good amount of information here relating to serious research and exposing hoaxes. Again, welcome aboard.
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Post by astropete on Feb 23, 2014 11:43:17 GMT 1
Thanks for the welcome, Ronigical.
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uforn
Administrator
Investigator In Training
In Search For The Truth
Posts: 5,400
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Post by uforn on Feb 23, 2014 13:42:14 GMT 1
Welcome to UFORN astropete
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uforn
Administrator
Investigator In Training
In Search For The Truth
Posts: 5,400
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Post by uforn on Feb 23, 2014 14:59:23 GMT 1
Hi Pete, being an astronomer have you ever seen anything that you couldnt explain ? given that your looking at the night sky all the time.
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Post by astropete on Feb 23, 2014 19:38:37 GMT 1
Hi Uforn. I don't think so. I've seen a few bright objects go overhead, some I've put down to being meteors, due to the fact that they have tails and moved in a manner I would expect a meteor to move, ie. straight across the sky from a known radiant, and others I've found to be satellites or aeroplanes when I've checked them on the various tracking apps on my Google Nexus.
I've never seen anything that's moved in a erratic manner or behaved "intelligently".
However, just because I've not seen anything doesn't mean they don't exist. For example I've never seen a baby pigeon, either, but adult pigeons have to come from somewhere.
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uforn
Administrator
Investigator In Training
In Search For The Truth
Posts: 5,400
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Post by uforn on Feb 24, 2014 2:34:36 GMT 1
I've never seen anything that's moved in a erratic manner or behaved "intelligently". However, just because I've not seen anything doesn't mean they don't exist. For example I've never seen a baby pigeon, either, but adult pigeons have to come from somewhere. I certainly agree with what your saying Pete. There is no dissputing UFO's exist the "BIG" question is are they controlled by "Aliens" For me at this moment in time I have no idea some cases would suggest so but there is very little conclusive evidence to prove it? I guess its what each person wants to believe, but putting all the evidence together certainly suggests a huge cover up of something related to UFO's, either alien or extra dimensional or something else we are hundreds of years away at solving.
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Post by astropete on Feb 24, 2014 12:46:51 GMT 1
I look at it this way. If I was an alien what would I do? Well for one, I wouldn't reveal myself to an aggressive, possibly hostile, species like humans. Maybe if the species was relatively primitive and only carried sticks as weapons, but not a species armed with advanced weaponry like missles, rockets, bombs, guns and nuclear weapons. Those types of creature may be unpredictable and stupid in large numbers. What I'd do is stay as invisible as possible and study small communities, collect samples and, like scientists do with animals on Earth, tag one or two with transmitters to learn their habits and territory. Maybe even take a few for a more thorough examination. The Earth is a big place, so there's plenty of places left where you could remain unseen if you wanted.
Why would I do it this way? Well, a small community, even in the modern world, is largely separate from big cities. There are plenty of small towns in America and other countries that are very much ignored by the larger population. If you're an alien, it's possible you've studied these people a long time and know there's less chance of being noticed due to the fact that there's less people out there. Also, most rural communities tend to be generally looked down upon by the city dwellers, meaning that if one of the people there does claim to have seen, or been taken by, aliens, nobody will believe him and will just put it down to a lack of education, insanity or stupidity.
As with everything there are likely to be mistakes made and I'll be seen and events like Roswell and Rendlesham Forest will occur. People may even learn what my vessels look like, or one of my people may be seen or captured, due to either carelessness on my part or underestimating the intelligence of the species I'm examining. My ships may even be caught on video or photograph. This would cause the paranoia levels of the people I'm studying to raise and more sightings of my ships to be reported, even though I wasn't there. Also, there will likely be people of a less stable nature who will make up tales, or will believe they are a member of the alien species, or be in contact with the aliens, so in time the reported events will far outnumber the actual events by quite a significant number. And the fact that many of these accounts outweigh the real events would lead the majority of the population to think that everyone who's seen a ship is either a nutball, someone wanting attention or someone trying to get rich by making up a story to sell a book.
So, if these things are aliens, you can see how events could evolve into a similar state to what we have here on Earth. However, the universe is a very big and complex place and some experimental physicists believe that anything you can think of can exist somewhere in the universe, or even in a parallel universe, so it could just be a massive coincidence that the hypothesis above seems to fit events. Also, I may just be a big geek who's watched too much Star Trek, and The X-Files, and have a really over active imagination.
So, you see, I don't know if the things that people seeing are alien, man made, natural phenomenon, or what... I know that 95% of these things are explained as perfectly normal things. But there's also that 5% that end up being classified as unknown, so what are these last 5%? Some of them do seem to exhibit signs of intelligent control, and the fact that it's such a small number that are classified as unknown fits very neatly into my ideas above.
Also, there are many people, like J. Allen Hynek that start off as sceptics and end up believers. Now it could be just to make a name for themselves and sell a few books, it may not. There's obviously a lot of complete rubbish in book form out there... There's also a few others that go the other way and start of as believers (or at least open minded to the possibilities that the UFO's might be alien) and end up as sceptics, like Edward Ruppelt.
But without more data, we simply do not know what they are. Unfortunately, I don't think that real data is going to be forthcoming as, even though I have heard several astronomers (professional and amateur) say that they'd like a proper study on UFO's to be done, there are none who are willing to go through the ridicule of being branded a kook or the risk of committing professional suicide. Even myself, who am not a famous astronomer but I do know many famous professionals and amateurs, have decided to go by a name on this forum that is slightly different from my usual Twitter and Facebook names for fear of my interest in UFO's getting out. Only my closest family know of my interest.
Unless one lands in the middle of Hyde Park and asks directions to Uranus, we don't know what they are. Maybe someone in the world does know what they are. The reports of MIB's intimidating witnesses must come from somewhere. And how is it if nobody has even seen an alien we all know what they look like, or are supposed to look like? The image has to have come from somewhere. Who was the first person to describe aliens as 3 foot tall humanoids with black eyes and large bulbous heads? Also, if they don't look like that, why was the undertaker at Roswell asked for several child sized coffins? A joke? A cover-up to throw the people off the scent of a secret US experiment (A fore runner the the F117?), an attempt by the undertaker to make some money off the story?
Bottom line. We don't know... There are far too many holes and not enough substance to make a judgement either way. When one fact points at aliens another one pops up that points at it being a hoax perpetrated by either the government or someone else, and if you're not careful you could end up running around in cirles until you vanish up your own tailpipe.
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